Comments on: Waiter, There’s Woo in My Food, Part 4: Landmark Forum & Cafe Gratitude https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/ Thu, 31 Mar 2016 18:24:25 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.com/ By: Artoo45 https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-24556 Sat, 25 Oct 2014 18:40:59 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-24556 Happy, happy, happy? Uh huh. I did the Forum, Advanced Course, and the SELP. Life is empty and meaningless and it’s meaningless that it’s empty and meaningless. (That’s it kids, I just saved you several thousand bucks and endless badgering). I got some good things from the Forum. The other courses were just me searching for the Original High™ of the Forum . . . and lots of busywork. The one thing I took away from Landmark is stay the fuck away from organizations like Landmark. I know, I know “why are you making Landmark wr . . . wr . . . wrong? Here’s a hanky, you figure it out.

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By: skepticalvegan https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-20581 Thu, 11 Sep 2014 02:39:11 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-20581 You are welcome to point out typos to be fixed if you wanna be helpful…but Im not sure that was the point.

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By: Melinda Parris https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-20552 Wed, 10 Sep 2014 22:13:58 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-20552 I love what you’re saying about Café Gratitude, I’m putting that place on my bucket list! Oh, and I love Landmark, too.:)
Say what you want (and it might carry more credence with a little spell and grammar check), I went into the course as a 54-year old resigned, bitter, unhappily retired social worker, who’d had decades of training in human development, therapy and personal exploration with no positive or lasting results. I was pretty sure I wasn’t going to learn anything new, but my mean boss was making me go – and 3 days later I came out like a rebooted computer – fresh and clear and happy, happy, happy!
Life has been great for the last 6 years, and I’m eternally grateful to my boss (who’d trained with Werner in the early days), for the gift of a future that was never going to happen without his “pressure” to attend. I fully endorse the Landmark Forum and all of their courses, which millions participate in annually, all around the world.

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By: skepticalvegan https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3682 Wed, 18 Sep 2013 18:16:23 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3682 Thanks for reporting back!

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By: Mike https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3680 Wed, 18 Sep 2013 15:35:39 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3680 I just got back from the three hour ‘graduation’ last night. I must admit that this speaker was totally different. They must have a rotating schedule of speakers for each forum in the different cities. I did not see the wild enthusiasm surrounding the previous speaker. And this guy was pretty good at explaining what Landmark was about through a mini lecture and analysis of the participant’s experience.
The previous speaker, for my daughter, was very aggressive and really pushed the course as a path to success in life, mostly to the point of making money. Which I consider as just pushing peoples buttons. There was little explanation of the forum and no participants, so I gained nothing about their ‘philosophy’.
One of the first questions we got as guests and participants was what could I get out of the training and what they got out of the training and how my getting it would help my life. Yes, there is an IT.
After that, it was the, what you know and don’t know etc. and the circles … (you can see these on the net). I have to admit this guy was very logical and made a good point. Then it was on to the participants affirmations.
Most of what these people have or are going through, I have been through and successfully worked it out on my own. There was a point I started to get upset and my wife got worried, but deep breath and calm down. This was totally different than my daughter’s ‘graduation’ as I was P.O.’d most of the time.
We took a break after 1.5 hours and went outside to talk. The last part of the night was devoted to an example of a breakdown from one of the guests. He walked this person through it and described to everyone that this is what you can expect from the training. This was simply no more than that person describing a problem of the day and he kept asking her questions to help her realize what the answer might be and possibly come to a conclusion. I guess some people need that guidance in their lives.
There was the pitch to register guests for the forum. It turns out that after taking the forum, you are entitled to take free seminars (good for the following year). The volunteers and staff really pushed the participants to continue with the seminars. I would say that participants should digest what they have ‘learned’ for a couple of months and then decide if and when to take the seminars. They also did push the advanced course for the graduates again as they did on the third day. Again, digest what you may have learned and then decide. But there were still a lot of people that signed up. Luckily not my wife. She was not chastised in front of me for not doing this, luckily. And I was with her the whole time. You can read other stories on the net.
In Jr. High (‘72-‘73), we were deluged with anti-drug education and one of the stories is that drug dealers offered free samples to get you hooked and keep you coming back. Heck, I was offered free drugs while driving down Freemont St in Vegas back in ’83.
Overall, this was a much more pleasurable experience than the previous one. NO, I have no plans to take the Landmark Forum. My life has been lucky. I have gone through a lot of the same experiences and I have learned to deal with them on my own. Do I still have problems? Yes (minor), and I can take what I have learned in my lifetime and what he told us in the first half of the ‘graduation’ to help me deal with them.
They make a point of saying that this course will change EVERYONE’s life greatly for the better. I still do not believe that. But some people will benefit. Young people who have not experienced much or have had many problems in their short life. But hey, that is part of life, dealing with problems and working it out. And there are those who have a hard time dealing with problems in general. In some cases, it is cheaper and a lot faster than therapy. You can also get a lot this same information from management training classes offered by your Human Resources Department. Albeit, in a very diluted form. (ie Boss is a Jerk analogy).
As in college there are many different professors with different personalities. Good and Bad. I think my wife got one of the good ones. I would not recommend this course to any I know, as most of my people are pretty ‘normal’. But there are a few that should take a look at it. And I would definitely not recommend it if the that was the same person that ‘coached’ my daughter.
About the What You Know (YK), What You Don’t Know (DK), and What You Don’t Know You Don’t Know (DKDK): a confusing premise: What I understood is YK and DK (self explanatory). This is the realm of human knowledge and most everyone is constantly trying to learn to expand their knowledge. The DKDK is the dilemma. Coming from a science background, I believe this to be the unknown aspects of physics and nature. From what I heard last night, it seems to me that they are probing the human Psyche (ID, ego and superego), hence Therapy. It could also be religion and self-awareness.
I don’t think it is for everyone. Again, digest what you have ‘learned’ (give it a good 3-6 months) and then decide whether or not to take any more courses. This is what scared me with my wife. I was afraid of ‘brainwashing’ and all that nonsense.
I’ll let you know if anything happens.

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By: skepticalvegan https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3674 Tue, 17 Sep 2013 15:31:53 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3674 Thanks for sharing Mike. Do keep me updated. I’m interested to hear how it goes.

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By: Mike https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3673 Tue, 17 Sep 2013 14:09:46 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3673 Our daughter went to the forum at the request of her supervisor. She has been having a tough time at work and they helped pay for it. I received the breakdown call on the second day. She was apologizing to me for all sorts of things that I had no idea. Yea, and she said she loved me about 10 times. She also said she has been pushing the family away and would like to bring the family back together. Funny thing she has not talked to me since that day (~1 month).
This might be due to the fact that my wife has gone through the forum. I had voiced some seriously strong objections to her attending the class. Including the horror stories and est. But she very calmly said she wants to see what she can get out of it. No argument. Have you seen Semi-Tough with Burt Reynolds? She seemed already indoctrinated. I received the phone call on the second day and it was not the intensely emotional breakdown you her about. She understood my concerns for her taking this class and also would like to get the family closer together. This must be a common thread in the Forum.
I will attend her ‘graduation’ tonight. She seems OK so far. I want to be present to talk to some of the other people. I also want to see how much farther they push their agenda.
I did attend our daughter’s ‘graduation’ and knew immediately what was going on. It was more intense that AMWAY. These people reacted to the speaker as if he were the second coming. I have never seen people in person reacting like this. Not even in AMWAY. (I mention AMWAY because my wife got into that for about a year). They have strategically spaced volunteers to convince people that they need this class. One guy tried this, but it was ultimately my daughter that convinced my wife that the class would be good. We left after two hours as I was really upset.
I will see what happens tonight.

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By: skepticalvegan https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3614 Thu, 05 Sep 2013 02:01:41 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3614 You should check out my latest post in this series on Falun Gong. Ive still got a few more ideas so more posts should be on the way.

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By: JawkDNA https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3613 Thu, 05 Sep 2013 01:19:29 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3613 Another awesome write up! Thanks!

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By: Anna https://skepticalvegan.com/2013/08/31/waiter-theres-woo-in-my-food-part-4-landmark-forum-cafe-gratitude/#comment-3593 Tue, 03 Sep 2013 22:51:47 +0000 http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/?p=1126#comment-3593 I’ve heard too many horror stories about Landmark bleeding people’s bank accounts dry. If the restaurant wants “better communication, honesty, openness, and a no-gossip policy,” the management can organize training sessions on their own, without outsourcing it to a third party that charges exorbitant prices to people who can barely afford it anyway (unless waiting tables or washing dishes at a raw vegan restaurant is waaaay more lucrative than I’m assuming).

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